Is This Woman Plus Size?

Jen looks pretty , sexy and desireable,
Bergland looks like an escapee from a german prison camp.
Women who buy into that look are just stupid.. its just to a way to sell overpriced clothes to ignorant women without actually putting them on a hanger! they walk the clothes down the catwalk on a human hanger..all invented by bitchy gay men and their fag hag counterparts..Wake up girls!

I weep for humanity when a size 12 is considered plus size!!! In the photos above, Jen looks healthy and well proportioned. Marianne looks like a walking skeleton.
Poor Jen; I hope she won't get all freaked out like the latest American Idol did and run off and lose 40 pounds to be considered acceptable.

It's not just that she's only a size 10, but she's a size 10 at 5'11"! Just when I was feeling pretty good about being an 8-10 at 5'8"... :-P I think Jen Hunter looks gorgeous.

I may be jumped on for saying this, but... I think both women are beautiful. I believe the fashion industry needs to embrace all body types and that means all ends of the spectrum from the very skinny to the overweight. All those swimsuit pictures are evidence of is a swimsuit that was designed for someone who has an hourglass figure.

Just because Marianne looks thin and granted her ribs look like they're poking out, does not mean she has any kind of health issues, so I'm going to refrain from passing judgment.

The greatest designer is one whose designs work in the real world and not just on paper.

i agree with everyone, especially nic. i do have to say though, that both models should be able to walk the catwalk on the same night in the same show. if diversity of ethinicity and gender is so big in businesses, why not in the business of fashion? and why can't the diversity include body shape and size?

Seriously.... if a 325 lb, spandex wearing, 5'4" woman came down the catwalk, I'd say she was too fat and to get the heck out. But this? She's NOT FAT.

The sad thing is, I have a friend who is considered too skinny by her doctor. Her BMI is very low, and everyone who has met her first notices how skinny she is. Yet she doesn't look bony like many of the fashion models - because she isn't starving herself to be at the weight she is. And, she would be considered "too fat" by the fashion model industry.

The real problem is twofold:

1) The fashion model "industry" is at a complete disconnect from real society. A bunch of old coots who made their money selling unrealistic expectations to women with the money for the plastic surgery to reach them, decide what is beautiful.

2) Retouching of photos gets cheaper and cheaper each day. They can hang their clothes on a skeleton however they want, and just edit out the jutting bones during retouching. Ever notice how you see these ultra-bony pictures of a model, but the PUBLISHED pictures never look this way?

If there is a beter looking pair of legs than Jan Hunter's, I'd like to see them. In fact, the rest of her is quite beautiful as well. Love those plus sized women.

Brittany said:
It's not just that she's only a size 10, but she's a size 10 at 5'11"! Just when I was feeling pretty good about being an 8-10 at 5'8"... :-P I think Jen Hunter looks gorgeous.[...]

Yes she does. 5'11" is quite tall.

As a gal who has lived with the societal pressures all her fricken life, I gotta say I'll take Jen's body any day over Marianne's. In fact, I like Jen's body better than most models I see in Vogue.

I do not want to have bones poking outta my torso!!!!

My husband lost 35 pounds over the last year plus, and while he's hardly a skinny-winny, I can feel bones when I hug him now, when I coudln't before. Not the nicest feeling. I don't want him embracing me and feeling ribs and hip bones poking. No. I like a bit of flesh on my fella and on me. Though, granted, there is WAY too much flesh on me.

The fact that that gorgeous Jen is considered not thin enough is a scary, scary, scary thing.

I think she's stunning. And I don't consider her plus-sized. She just happens to be TALL, above average height for women. Way above average. So, of course, she can carry more weight and look fabulous.

The Princess

Jen is gorgeous! The swimsuit looks terrific on her, but I don't think it looks good AT ALL on Marianne. Is it just me, or do her hip bones and ribs sort of make the suit look bizarre? I wish there were more diversity in the modeling industry...not just more "plus sized" models, but more petite models and more models that aren't white. Sure I think the models in most magazines are fine looking, but they never look like me or anyone I know. How are you supposed to buy clothes that will flatter you if you don't see them on someone that looks like you? That's why I LOVE IT when magazines do features with real women that are modeling clothes. It lets you see what the clothes will actually look like on a real person.

Jen looks fantastic. Classic A-frame body, great legs, probably got a nice ass too.

A little lacking up top, though. I'd have her hit the gym and put on 10-20 pounds. Build a well-rounded hourglass figure.

Oh, and program her to love me. Perfection!

Ok first off the plus size model IS NOT 154LB. I see bodies all day and she is much closer to 175-180 ish. so lets first be honest about her weight.

Oh Sean, thank god there are people like you who can determine a persons weight from one small, posed, single angle photograph.

Quickly, write a book, you must share your gift with the world!

sean said:
Ok first off the plus size model IS NOT 154LB. I see bodies all day and she is much closer to 175-180 ish. so lets first be honest about her weight. [...]

You know, seems to me you might be right on that. Hard to say for sure, but now that you mention it, to have a decent amount of flesh on your bones at her height, seems you'd need to weigh more than 154 lbs.

I agree with Nic too, but why can't there be an in between? That'd be the perfect model, because honestly no one likes fat or deep hollows under eyes and bones poking out.

For the sake of accuracy, Jen did not win the competition . She came in third. The winner was Albert Mordue, a male model (it was a mixed male/female competition). Marianne came in fourth, though both made it the final show.

I watched the whole show, and while I don't believe in size-zero models and such, there were a number of other reasons why Jen wasn't the judge's favorite. She had a rather bad attitude, didn't listen to advice, faked illness to get out of 'challenges', and so on. But the UK tabloid press took up her cause and made her a willing victim. I think it was made easier by the fact that Marianne was a very quiet, softspoken girl and wasn't British (she is Swedish). That particular photo makes her look the absolute worst, but in most other challenges including other swimsuit shoots she looked healthy and fine.

I'm rather surprised that you chose to pick this up now too since the show itself ended last October! For what it's worth both Marianne and Jen are still working as models - Jen does commercials for cellphones, and Marianne is a more high-fashion model. (Marianne was signed by the modelling agency that sponsored the show, while Jen wasn't.) Those niches are probably right for both.

The reason the story is being picked up now is because it was this week that it was revealed that Jen had to change agencies. The one that signed her up sent her to castings where she wasn't being picked. Read the top piece again and focus on the word 'recently'.

That we could all be so plus-sized. ;)

Is Jen too fat? Of course not.

But there's another factor in play whenever you pursue a career in modeling or acting. You can get turned down for reasons that aren't reasonable.

So whether your skin is fat or thin, it'd better be thick.

You guys realize that the job of models is to wear clothes, don't you? Specifically, they wear "samples." Samples are the single, one-of-a-kind garments made by samplemakers, who make them from the one-of-a-kind patterns made by a designer's patternmaker. These samples are shown to retailers and modeled by models, and _if_ they sell, only then are they "graded" to other sizes and actually manufactured. In the case of couture, they are only graded and made when end-user customers order them.

So the question is not, Is she fat?, but rather is she the size of the samples of the designers that need to hire her for jobs. Samples are made in a "medium" (middle of the range; it might not be called "medium") for the designer's size range (the sizes can be rather large for a plus size line of clothes, but usually they are "normal"), so that grading can be done up and down without too much distortion.

If this woman did not properly fit the samples that her employer's clients needed to be modeled, she'd lose her job. And then there are the reasons mentioned by Debbie, to boot.

I am a plus sized model, so I will answer from my standpoint....the answer to your question is simple...is she plus sized? Yes. Plus size is a category determined by the fashion industry for sample sizes 10-22(ish, depending on the designer, it can start at size 8 and go higher than 22). Sample size for plus sized models is 12/14. Someone already explained about sample sizes.

While it's true that more high fashion designers should be aware of the need for larger sizes based on their customers, the reality is models exist to display and sell the clothes that the designer makes. It's cheaper to make sample sizes smaller (I'm not defending it, but it's true), and it is often said that the women who model those clothes are to be "human clothing hangers." Ie, you are to pay attention to the clothes, not the model. Of course that's not what happens, but that's the idea...

It is society who glorifies the fashion industry, but the fashion industry does a great disservice by refusing to recognize the impact it has on society as a whole. Plus models are marketable like never before, and many designers are expanding their lines. That being said, Hunter's agencey either should not have signed a plus model it could not find work for, or worked harder to find jobs that she could book. On the converse side, if Hunter wasn't booking the jobs they sent her to, her agency isn't obligated to keep on their board.

We like to vilify agencies, but they simply listen to what their customers (the designers, ad campaign managers, etc) are asking for and respond accordingly. It is not singularly the fault of the fashion industry that we have such standards...and it is unlikely they will change in the future. Please don't think I'm advocating the "thin is in" mantra, it's just the reality of the situation.

What we can do is look to alternative sources...magazines aimed at "plus" sized audiences (bombshell, skorch, etc) or clothes that are designed specifically for those sizes. They say the dollar is the loudest vote...if CK won't use plus models, and you don't like it, don't buy their clothes.

Anyhow, that's my perspective...it's a little different when you're in the industry...change the things you can, accept the things you can't and have the wisdom to know the difference...

If Jen Hunter is a plus size than I want to look just like her. She is so pretty and her body looks great. Jen don't change a thing you're beautiful just the way you are.

Spectra's comments were spot-on - it's great in the rare cases when magazines and shows feature "real" women modeling clothes. I've taken to watching "What Not to Wear" on Friday nights and I love it. They encourage women to feel comfortable with how their bodies are right now, and dress to minimize flaws and accentuate the positives, which we all have.

The good news is....Avon Cosmetics UK have taken Jen on to model underwear.

The bad news is the have her advertising control briefs which are 'great for taking inches off your tummy and perking up your bum'.

I feel a complaint coming on.....

If thats a plus size , wonder what a plus size would be called?

I know my husband, like most men, would easily choose Jen over the poor, cachectic model. I don't know why society supports too-thin models, since most people do not. It is the high-end fashion industry that does, and many there don't like women anyway.

For example, look at the low-end fashion photos in Blair.com or JC Penney. These women are hardly too thin. On the other hand, most photos of plus size lingerie or swimsuits do not show plus-size models.

The other model looks WAY too skinny and bony. But to be fair, I have a sister who is extremely thin--and I'm sure most would think she has an eating problem. She doesn't, though she has no thryoid (cancer in her early 20's).

And yeah, I'd love to look like the first one ;) I may get to the wieght, but I'd need the rack to strech me out LOL

sean said:
Ok first off the plus size model IS NOT 154LB. I see bodies all day and she is much closer to 175-180 ish. so lets first be honest about her weight. [...]

ACTUALY SEAN. =] considering the fact your a guy, I'm sure you know alll about woman. Especaily since I'm 16, very close to her height and i AM 180 pounds. you sir, are an idiot. =] girls dont way the same as guys. and if she was 180 she really would be overweight. i would know first hand. she is a healthy looking woman and, she deserves to be more than just a model, but the new POSTERCHILD of healthy weight. Then again, if you rather do the humpty dump with a bone thin corpse, well good for you,

I think the lady is BEAUTIFUL as she is. I think society has a way of making women feel they need to be a size 4 to be accepted. And its very wrong in my eyes and sets a bad example to young ladies that are just trying to be comfortable with in their own skin.
All women are Beautiful no matter what their size.We are all made to be different.
I am a BBW I say I may not be every persons type of woman but for the one that matters I am his all his everything and he loves me as I am. I don't care what society thinks.

I think Jen is sexy.
It's the modeling industry that has a problem with size. I think they want models to be that skinny to save more money on clothes.

Jen has beautiful curves and looks happy!! Marianne not so much.

first of all, I don't know ANY plus-sized women who want a size 10 girl walking down the runway representing them. A size 10 girl is not the same as a size 14-16 or higher. Clothes fit a size 10 girl waaayyy different than a size 14. So if you have a size 10 girl (at close to 6ft at that) Modeling clothes for plus-sized women (and I mean truely plus sized) the clothes are not going to be represented the way they should. And aren't runway shows supposed to be how to best show off a designer's designs? And If you go into a department store, you won't find size 10 in the plus-size section. And that's cause it doesn't belong there!!!! If the day comes when lane bryant and the avenue start designing for size 10 women..God help us all!

Don't y'all get it? GAY MEN ARE OUR ENEMY! THEY DESIGN THESE CLOTHES, THE PICK THE MODELS..GAY MEN LOVE PLUS SIZE GIRLS TO BE THEIR BUDS(SEE PEREZ AND BETH DITTO)BUT THEY WANT THEIR FASHIONS ON A SKELETON.

I GREW UP AND QUIT READING FASHION MAGS WHEN I WAS 13.

I MISS CINDY CRAWFORD. I MISS NICE TITS ON A MODEL. MODELS USED TO BE BAEUTIFUL. NOW, THEY ALL WANT STRIKING AND EDGEY GIRL/BOYS.

EWWW.....

I agree with Sara, that since the models are walking hangers for the designers samples.The designer hopes that at least some of the samples will be sold & manufactured.Once the checks are signed,I think with a decent amount of certainty the designer doesn't care if the order consists of size 2 or size 22 as long as the check clears.The designer has to have a standard size he/she cuts as a sample and whatever that size is has to be what every other designer is using (pretty much),and what will fit the majority of the models. I am not talking just weight but height also. Fashion is a cut throat buisness.Like most businesses you want to make a profit. I do not like woman starving themselves to be models,some even dyeing for the career they love, but it is there choice.It is their body's, the same goes with abortions woman die from those,it is rare but it does happen. There are a large group of models that are just natural skinny and some who want the career so bad they will starve themselves.If you think about it,even I can see why the designers want small.Less money and time to make smaller sizes.Less storage for the smaller sizes. I wanted to be a model when I was younger,but now I am 50 and sz 18,so I know I have a better chance of seeing God.But, I am a Nationality Certified Master Dog Groomer. I wish I knew how to groom the dogs in magazines and commercials because Gezz,so many look so ratty. I know I can make them look drop dead gorgeous. Because of this I relate everything in to Dog logic.If I was going to show off a bunch of dogs to a group of buyers. I had no idea of what they liked,what color or colors,longhair or short,pushed in face or not. I would fill my van with little dogs,lots of them. Telling the buyer I can get them in any size you want .I surly wouldn't fill it up with 3 xlg dogs,would lesson my chance of a sale .Personally I don't think sz 12 is a plus size.If I were a size 12 I would do nude modeling,lol. I think plus sizes should be sz 16 up. I wish retailers would do that show what the outfit would look like on a 16-18-20-22etc. Maybe even give specs .Model is 5'8" 163 lbs, wearing a size 18,now that would be cool.Jennylyn

If a 10 is plus size then we need a mega size.
http://www.shegoddess.com

sean said:
Ok first off the plus size model IS NOT 154LB. I see bodies all day and she is much closer to 175-180 ish. so lets first be honest about her weight. [...]

I agree. I am 5' 9" and weigh 172 lbs. I wear size 8-10 and I know I look thinner than Jen. Don't get me wrong. I think she looks fabulous whatever her weight is!

I think Jen's body is perfect for modeling. It would be nice to see those curves in the modeling industry.

The question posed here "Is Jen Hunter a plus size woman?" The truth of the answer would depend on who you are asking. In society the answer would be no...in fact she would be of average or below average in size. Her height stretches out all 154 pounds to a point of being considered thin. I think the average size for an american woman is 14...so she would be below average even. To the fashion world the answer would be yes she is a plus sized model. I think a better question would be "Why is Jen Hunter considered a plus size model in the fashion industry?". I respect fashion as an art form it inspires many of the clothes we wear today. It takes clothing and pushes it to an extreme. It is not so much about outfits that you would wear ever off the runway, it is more about the exploration of colors, textures, and the way cloth fits the human form. In fact the clothes you see on the runway are more or less like the abstract paintings you see hanging in art galleries. They are not meant to be an exact representation of their subject matter...but more an inspiration for the viewer...to come to his/her own conclusion. So why is it that designers do pick stick thin women with short hair that have no breasts and look more like young boys than young ladies? HMMMMMMMMMMM who are most of the designers today? Maybe these designer men would rather see young men dressed as women, but know the world is not quite ready to accept their own view of beauty just yet, so they seek out the next best thing. A woman that has no hips, no breasts, and basicly as far from the true female body as possible because in their own eyes this is what is attractive. To me personally I believe that being a woman is about having curves, having bosoms (large or small) having a little extra padding around the hips. It is about having babies and being happy. And in the two pictures above I have to say that both models facial expressions are more important than thier bodies, Hunter is smiling and looks excited to be alive and being photographed, the thin model just looks like she rolled out of bed with a hangover and somehow ended up in this bathing suit (which doesn't even fit her)...she looks slightly confused and either angry or pained. Not sure of what is going on with her. I think in closing I will say this...looking healthy is always attractive...taken to either extreme of the weight scale makes you look sick. Being bloated and unable to walk without the risk of breaking your kneecaps or having a heart attack is unattractive and being too skinny makes you look like you suffer from a third world disease or live on a diet of cocaine, cigarettes, and diet coke or you spend to much time with your finger down your throat. Maybe even a better question would be..."Why as women do we let other people tell us what would make us happy and beautiful, are we so stupid we can't figure that out on our own?"

sean said:
Ok first off the plus size model IS NOT 154LB. I see bodies all day and she is much closer to 175-180 ish. so lets first be honest about her weight. [...]

If you saw bodies all day, then you would know that everyone carries their weight differently. She is more bottom heavy which can lead you to overestimate her weight.

She looks to be a UK-10 on top and a UK-12/14 on the bottom. And at 154lb and 5ft11, this is the size I would have estimated her to be. At the weight you are suggesting, she would be borderline overweight bigger than the size she is.

She is only a plus size model because average size models are so ridiculously thin, not because she is actually plus sized.

You are not the first man to assume he knows all about women's bodies, but in reality knows very little.

Actually, I am 5'11" and at my ideal weight, I am around 150-155, and I am right around the same size as her. I don't think she is 170. Even if she was though, that is not considered overweight for our height.
Regardless though, she is absolutely beautiful. I think that the other model is pretty too, but the swimsuit doesn't flatter her. I think with all her bones sticking out and whatnot, she looks heavier than the first model at first glance. Either way, I think it is messed up that she is considered "plus size"!

Amy said:
You know, seems to me you might be right on that. Hard to say for sure, but now that you mention it, to have a decent amount of flesh on your bones at her height, seems you'd need to weigh more than 154 lbs.

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